Daygame has become a cult. I’m as much to blame for it as anyone else and it’s not a particularly bad thing. It’s in the Constitution that every man has the right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of pussy. So while I occasionally bristle when I see no-hoper chodes queering Oxford Street with crappy Yad-stops, I do acknowledge that these men have as much right to hunt girls as I do. Good luck to them.
I just wish they’d be more…. finessed about it.
I suspect that 83% of all daygame stops follow exactly this pattern (half of them with an Indian accent):
- Excuse me, canIjustsaysomethingreallyquickly. IliterallyjustsawyouandIwantedtosay…
- You look nice
- You look French. It’syouhairniceeyesandsillyshoes
When the first-gen daygamers were figuring out the system, the front stop was merely a tool. It wasn’t the One True Way, it wasn’t The Perfect Approach. It was simply a useful party trick to stop a fast-walking girl on a crowded shopping street. We taught it in bootcamps because it’s easy to explain and has wide applicability.
Actual real live daygamers who get laid open from the front, the side, by calling “hey you” from a distance, obliquely at a bus stop, across a display table in a book store, in a coffee shop queue…. whatever. The London Daygame Model principles apply no matter what the mechanics of the first two seconds.
Unfortunately what has percolated into noob consciousness is a contrived front stop where every girl is French. This is missing the whole point. Daygame is spontaneous, authentic and based on what that girl makes you feel right there and then. It’s written into Nitro, go have a look. Rote-learning the canned Nice-French-Shoes opener is bastardising the whole thing. It’s like reducing Mystery Method down to a furry hat and Who-Lies-More.
I had the misfortune to hit a nice FSU location this weekend just after a bootcamp and while a few squareheads had jetted in for a Euro-jaunt. So the main promenade was like a carnival of strange men front-stopping everything. The poor girls couldn’t get from one end of the street to the other without five men telling them they look French.
And surprise surprise, the girls are defensive. That street now has a reputation for “weird sex tourists hassling girls” as my date last night told me. Fortunately she didn’t connect me to them.
So stop telling girls they look French. Stop standing with your legs splayed like a pyramid. Stop folding your arms precisely twenty seconds into the interaction. You’ve all got the right to try to get laid. More power to you. I write this blog and my books precisely to help you in your quest. But c’mon, use at least a little social intelligence. Daygame is a tool. It’s not a hobby, a fetish, or a club.
To learn daygame without acting like a retard, read Daygame Mastery
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May 22, 2014 at 11:38 pm
Krauser, total respect!!
Exactly at the point and well argumented.
This text should remain for eternity in books.
Regards from Berlin!
Sent from my iPhone
May 22, 2014 at 11:40 pm
The whole PUA farce is really starting to get on my tits. It encourages men with low social intelligence to “plow through” and “approach approach approach”, but that shit isn’t going to do any good if you’re an utter Bindi retard that doesn’t have the slightest concept of calibration. I don’t buy that the mere experience of approaching hundreds of girls only to get blown out due to ineptitude is any kind of learning experience. What is really important, the only thing that REALLY matters, is the internalization of Game and masculinity. Only then are you ready to apply the technical nuance of street pick up, and it will be a natural extension of self rather than a comedy of errors.
May 26, 2014 at 3:46 am
The main issue here is lack of self-awareness, The people that made the leap into the other side – not necessarily reaching alphahood, are very self-concious people, they manage to disect themselves accurately and truthfully – a painful process to say the least, and work on what really has to be done, I started making serious progress the moment I realized I was an omega, and started working accordingly.
Know thyself should be at the very begining of any game teaching-learning process.
May 22, 2014 at 11:46 pm
Come on Nick, you weren’t much different when you were starting out. (And a Geordie accent isn’t that much better is it? 😉 )
I was the same but it’s how you learn. I cringe when I look back on how I was in the beginning. It’s difficult to see yourself objectively because you are affecting behaviours which aren’t you. Half the time you are either shitting yourself approaching or you’ve pumped yourself up into ‘state’ – which at the time you think is super awesome and like some kind of super power – until you calm down, reflect on your interactions and realize you are being completely inauthentic and more akin to a dancing clown.
This realization only comes from 2 things;
1. Massive action – that means at least something like 500 approaches.
2. The ability to self-examine.
Most guys won’t do this/have this – not in this lifetime. You and I know (and so does Tom and the rest of the Daygame crew) that the vast bulk of people doing this are going to fail at it., as with any attempt to succeed in life, be it getting money or women or whatever, but that doesn’t sell books or videos does it?
Ca plus ca change ca plus la meme chose. [I put out the best theory I can and offer anyone a chance to buy it, but I think it’s only fair to warn them that most people will fail. K.]
June 8, 2014 at 7:18 pm
Geordie accent not much better than an Indian accent? Are you insane? forget it.
May 23, 2014 at 12:14 am
In other words by all means fail but don’t fuck our shit up while you’re at it. In computer science it’s called “failing silently” or “graceful termination”.
May 23, 2014 at 1:08 am
Pretty sure I was guilty of this till I had lived in the States for a couple of years; and it still sometimes springs out in moments of stress. Most Indian languages have a much faster cadence than English (interestingly Sanskrit, the oldest of them doesn’t — probably because of its frequent use of complex syllables like ‘kshva’ and such). That is why Indian people speaking English tend to reel it off, and in moments of stress, revert to their native accents. I usually make an attempt to slow down a lot, and that works. I sometimes feel stupid speaking so slowly, but American girls tell me I sound quite distinguished because of it, which is pretty funny.
May 23, 2014 at 1:25 pm
You’ve hit a point here. An Indian accent when slowed down about 500% and with a far greater tone oscillation (rather than the usual monotone) plus merged with a ridiculously posh English accent can sound outrageously distinguished.
May 26, 2014 at 6:05 am
No such thing as “Most Indian” languages. There are 2 vastly different languages in Indian. One is Indo-European (the word “Indo” referring specifically to India) and the Indian linguistic branch is called Indo/Aryan. (The bindi you refer to is formally a ‘laltika’). This group comprises Sanskrit and its descendants (Hindi, etc) and the cadence it pretty much identical to any other European language, including german or italian. English however can differ from all other mainstream Indo-European languages since it’s actually a creole, developed during the times when the court did it’s business in French and the commoners spoke/developed an ad-hoc mix of various dialects.
The other main Indian branch is Dravidian. This is Tamil etc, and these languages are about as far from Indo-European as you can possibly get. Simply no connection, you might as well be speaking Inuit.
Both groups are about 500 million each. That’s a whole lot of people in each group but they are totally different ethnicities and languages.
The other 100-200 million Indians speak Aboriginal and Asian languages (like Assamese).
June 1, 2014 at 10:50 pm
I am aware of this. Both the Indo/Aryan and Dravidian branches have a faster cadence than English, though the Dravidian ones are definitely *much* faster.
June 19, 2014 at 10:34 am
“Rote learning is still the major reality for teaching pedagogy in India,” Kugelman told me.
Weighing in on the buggy Indian code debate, Indian developer Shekhar Gulati wrote on his blog, “In India … students just cram the things and get [the] score but practically they know nothing.” Gulati pointed out that he once interviewed a computer scientist with a degree in the field and six years of experience who was unable to write a simple program during his test.”
May 23, 2014 at 1:10 am
I get where Nick’s coming from…
When you explicitly advertise the fruits of daygame, you’ll obviously attract a massive horde of men who will quite literally, go out and spam the streets who have no idea what they’re doing, which in turn will give the guys who genuinely know what they’re doing, a hard time due to the girls closing up and getting defensive.
In my opinion, I think everyone has the potential to be good at this. But the only caveat is, you have to know your potential and be willing to accept the maximum quality you’re able to get.
Assuming you’ve maximised your value in all areas and can honestly say that you’ve worked hard in all of them. If you’re only getting 6’s or 7’s, be willing to accept that that’s all you’ll be able to get in quality.
I think the takeaway message to this is to simply avoid being fooled by the charlatans that sell you the idea that you’ll be able to get 10’s consistently.
The world is unfair with many variables in place that determine your genetic future, which you cannot control. Just do the best you can, but realise and accept that you have a limit to what you can get.
May 23, 2014 at 1:41 am
Yes sometimes I wish less people knew about daygame as the hordes of Yad-stoppers cramp my style. But I also feel grateful that I had the chance to learn it. #innergameissues
May 23, 2014 at 3:23 am
I wanted to say that “Daygame Mastery” was a great template and blueprint. I don’t normally do “Daygame” as outlined but use everything in here when I’m out and about at parties, mixers, dances etc.
If it starts to sound like canned material then when you get thrown a curve ball you cave.
I learned much of this gradually and often through trial and error. Daygame Mastery allowed me to fine tune or confirm some skills.
But the best parts of the book are the chapters on inner game. I’d love to see more about these topics.
Reading from a script is not “learning” or adapting the learnings, it’s memorization and it pollutes the entire scene.
On the other hand, if there are chodes running around and you get good, you can separate yourself from them.
This clip is one of my favorites: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7a8zgfSwTCo
May 23, 2014 at 5:03 am
100% agree with walawala. I imstinctively moved from yadstop and used some of the “openers” principally identical to options in mastery months before it was published. I used conviction as described in Tom’s books to take girls home from a nightclub, almost without words. I stopped girl on zebra crossing when she crossed on red with “So you like to take the risk…”. I opened indirectly and followed the model with early spikes. Mastery is so much more than narrow Daygame model. Recently I saw Daygamers Episode 1 and 2 by Daygame. One out of about 6 guys came across ok. (white polo guy) Still some Jon Matrix lines but he had the subcommunications and value nailed. Other guys were either clueless harmless wannabeacoachsoon teddybears or antisocial script reading robots. It was clear none of them actually improved. They forced their shitty film projection on girls who were quite uncomfortable but polite enough to stay for a while. Really viscerally painful to watch, especially when they reinforced each other with empty marketing lines.
May 23, 2014 at 4:22 pm
“Really viscerally painful to watch, especially when they reinforced each other with empty marketing lines”
My exact thoughts. Glad Torero and K are calling out the bullshit going on. Sell the consumer concrete plans to action but don’t sell us bullshit dreams. Good shit, K. [Precisely. It can be done, but don’t have an illusions what it requires you to find inside yourself. K.]
May 23, 2014 at 6:57 am
Tom has a bit in his first book on this called The Daygame Toolbelt and the Law Of The Instrument. It is all about social intelligence and not being a robot. I see wannabe daygamers all across my city (Vienna) and they all just copy each other. Low IQ and low creativity. Glad Tom left daygame.com as the marketing promises there are cringeworthy.
May 23, 2014 at 10:24 am
Elephant in the room: aren’t many of your approaches like that? Not hating, just making a legitimate observation. They all seem to start with ‘I literally just saw you, and I wanted to say [push/pull opener].
May 23, 2014 at 1:27 pm
Pro-boxers could knock most people out with a jab.
May 23, 2014 at 10:29 am
Exactly what i have been thinking recently. Some of them are so bad they make me cringe they run around stopping everyone. I hate being put in the same bracket as a daygamer “who do you follow” noone im just fucking me mate.
May 23, 2014 at 4:47 pm
We’ve heard the same here except it’s locals who are pretending to be British and hitting on the girls here in Jelly. [Do they put on fake Geordie and Cardiff accents? K.]
May 23, 2014 at 4:51 pm
Excellent post. I’ve written about exactly this before.
May 23, 2014 at 4:56 pm
This daygame party is not so swinging as I had anticipated.
May 23, 2014 at 5:26 pm
what is really strange is that the girls usually come to me. why is that? im not even particularly good looking,
May 23, 2014 at 7:57 pm
It’s a double-edged sword, you have to start somewhere and you have to learn some kind of basic structure in the beginning so everyone has done it at some point. Tom T had to tell me to quit freestylin’ and stick to the structure, because sometimes I would work myself into a dead end or end up being too entertaining. Anyway, my point is these guys are going to be out there. There will be guys that have nothing to work with, so they will rigidly stick to the structure. The guys who don’t quickly adapt will filter out and settle back to their regular non-approaching lifestyle. It will be an occasional nuisance for the more advanced guys and girls on the street, but nothing that can’t be overcome since advanced guys are not spouting the same monotonous drivel and you can easily adapt to the newbies descending upon the girls as a plague of locusts.
May 24, 2014 at 12:43 am
You’ve got to stop trying to lord it over people to make yourself feel superior. Perhaps england gave you the finger and it is finished, so you make the most of the opportunities you have; mabye you’d have made it a better place given the chance. Bitterness does not suit you when you are capable of so much more.
May 24, 2014 at 5:49 am
When the chasm between your current state and some kind of budding mastery level is too far it comes out as incredibly awkward. Most chodes would need some sort of therapy best by a PUA-lifestyle-therapist. Greater Betas usually do way better especially with the current level of excellent PUA-material out there.
Either way – I would not be concerned about it – most will learn some Game, snag a girl and leave the most of the approaches to the “Pros”. In a world filled with cads there would be 1000x more approaches done by men. Still only the best would succeed.
May 24, 2014 at 6:49 pm
The guys you talk about in this article are at a certain stage of their development in daygame.
When you first start learning anything, you learn by rote. Although long term rote knowledge won’t allow you to get good at a complex skill, people need to start out this way. I think this is because when you’re first learning something you are so incompetent at it that learning and really taking on board the reasoning behind certain techniques to the extent which you can move beyond the technique and rely on general principles is beyond you, as this requires experience that you don’t have as a beginner.
I’d say the opening phase of a cold approach seduction, regardless of environment (day / night) comes down to one thing: get the girl’s attention whilst projecting masculine polarity. On a dance floor that might mean strong eye contact whilst pulling her in by hand without saying a word. On the street jumping in front of her and using a preframed personalised opener has been proven to work well for stopping moving girls and getting them to fully focus their attention on you. If I tell a noob to approach on Oxford Street by getting her attention, and at the same time make sure you display masculinity, there are many ways he potentially can do this, but he won’t have a fucking clue what to actually do. If I tell him, jump in front of her and say this, he now has actionable advice.
The shitty rote learning is just a phase guys go through. You’re right that they need to progress from that, but the phase can’t be skipped. It’s like the beginners hell phase. That’s where I’m at now I’ve decided to give daygame a proper shot. More experienced guys can keep me on the right path and make sure this phase only lasts for 500 approaches instead of 2,000, but they can’t help me skip the phase entirely. I have to pay my dues and get the experience.
May 24, 2014 at 8:02 pm
What’s up with Krauser and his hate of Indian guys? When you read between the lines it’s as if he wishes they would all crawl into a hole and never attempt to even sniff pussy ever again. He has written so many anti Indian tweets and posts there just has to be a good story behind it. I noticed that Rooshv also hates Indians and had a big flame war on his forums due to it.
There are very few Indian guys where I live so I’m not sure what the deal with them is. Are they just big assholes and fuck shit up for everyone else ( like ghetto blacks in USA ) ?
May 24, 2014 at 11:26 pm
Roosh just stated that the Indian race is least favoured by women on this planet. He also said that he has plenty of Indian friends and now quite Game-savvy. Krauser also likely meets a lot of awkward Indian guys in London trying to learn Game via a highly intellectual IT-like method. Either way it is just a sign of our times. No reason to be offended.
I personally know some Indian guys who are veritable pussy-slayers. One is a 5’7 40-year-old entrepreneur with a little beer-pouch but Alpha-as-hell attitude (and no funny accent). He is moderately successful but not wealthy and he is average looking. What attracts prime pussy is his Alpha state and dominant being – he is also fun to be around, so he easily beds 20-year-olds even without much formal Game knowledge, since he lives in Budapest which is easier for Game than London.
The other guy is a 6’3 muscular good-looking Indian guy who just runs Good Looking Guy Game asking straight up for blowjobs with a perfect Bad-Boy-Grin and getting them 🙂
Women react to Inner Game more than to anything else – suddenly they get all wet because of a 5’7 40-year-old Indian dude. Go figure!
May 25, 2014 at 1:59 pm
I have an Indian friend who has awesome game and regularly cleans up.
He’s not your typical Indian though and is well dressed, very well spoken and hits the gym regularly. We did a bit of damage in Krakow a few years ago and will be going to Prague in a few weeks.
The point is, if you make the best of yourself, any guy has the potential to get laid.
May 29, 2014 at 12:57 pm
He doesn’t hate Indian guys, I’m an Indian guy and been friends with Nick for many years, and even if he hates Indians, who gives a fuck, they are his views. People are allowed to have opinions but whether you respect them is up to you, he’s not demanding you respect his opinion (of hating indian ‘dudes’ as you call it), you’re presuming that’s his opinion and denouncing it.
Anyway, yes Indian’s in general are cunts, years of colonisation firstly from arabs then the british made them weak and pussified.
May 25, 2014 at 8:20 pm
So the Mystery thing happens again. Some guy (or a few guys) works very hard to become very good at seduction, thousands take notice and then emulate his “method” by simplifying what he does down to a caricature and make fools of themselves. Most guys are overwhelmed by the demands of game and never grow past this clown phase. Seduction is obviously for the few, very elite.
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May 28, 2014 at 12:50 am
OK; I can understand your frustration at a bunch of fools bastardizing your art. That’s legit, that’s real.
The mental image of an entire street of men harassing girls with strange, identical, contrived-sounding dialogue, however, is hilarious. That’s sketch comedy material there. Weird sex tourists indeed. The locals must have been baffled. Lucky they didn’t think it was some sort of cult.
May 28, 2014 at 1:14 pm
Nitro 2nd ed. just arrived. I’ll post review on Lulu later. I also have Mastery, I almost finished it. While I feel that theoretically I have no problem understanding any concept in Mastery and lot of them resonate well with my experience – girl types, obstacles I faced in some stages…I feel for my own good I need to simplify the date model compared to that in Mastery for now, because in these later stages I am less experienced. The complexity adds too much stress and often leads to avoidance of dates and escalation beyond flirting and touching. Also, many of us simply need more cold approach lays to truly carve ourselves as R-selected men. Feminine energy, being relaxed around girls, even being considered Casanova by some guys or girls in your social circle is one thing, but it is not what you do it for. For this reason, Nitro 2nd is a great resource. Most guys will overestimate how far they are with Daygame but as K. says, Mastery – as practical guide- is for those who get laid at least once a month from cold approach. That’s the only valuable metrics. There was a gap in the market as Tom’s original Daygame book, while also aimed at beginner/intermediate audience, is not a textbook, and original Nitro was too narrow/rushed. Steve Jabba’s Home Study System is good as well but there are too many deviations from standard London Daygame Model and Krauser is better writer who simply puts more attention to his products in terms of overall presentation and organisation. Looking forward to it! [thanks boss! K.]
May 30, 2014 at 3:46 pm
x-man, which book would you say is best for a beginner [but not a clueless chode lol] ?
June 1, 2014 at 8:45 am
Mastery is more interesting intellectually as there is a chance you’ll learn some new concept. But if you haven’t done łot of cold approaching and dating, Nitro is less stressful. I am able to read Nitro in one longer day (I’m a reader) and feel energised to approach, while Mastery it is more about reading maybe 50 pages a day if you want to internalize it. So it can actually get in the way of you approaching because you’ll want to master it first which takes a lot of time. If I had to buy one forever I would buy Mastery and listen to SMV video talk by K. If you take your time I guess you could start with Mastery but I say this after reading Nitro 1st ed., Torero’s Daygame, Travels, Rational Male, watching Daygame.com video products etc. so I wasn’t newbie when i ordered Mastery.
Also depends how much money you want to invest, if you are a beginner in a sense you didn’t cold approach and didn’t read much material I’d choose Nitro. You may “know” most of the stuff in Nitro but the value is in having complete condensed model you can do right now without long, fatiquing study sessions. [Thanks for the breakdown. K.]
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June 4, 2014 at 11:57 pm
The matter of telling every girl she looks French reminded me of the complaint, by American software developers, that their Indian colleagues will be very good at rote-learned solutions but poor at general problem-solving.
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