“I cannot forecast to you the action of Russia. It is a riddle wrapped in a mystery inside an enigma; but perhaps there is a key” Winston Churchill, 1st October 1939
There was something in the air during my October trip to Kiev. A couple of months earlier I’d taken my first trip out and been reasonably impressed over the ten days – nice city centre architecture, lively atmosphere, pretty girls, decent reactions on the street. However I’d come away scratching another location off my quest for Pussy Paradise. In some respects it was like sitting in the front row of a Victoria Secrets catwalk show – just because hot lithe girls are parading a few feet away in tight clothes does not mean you’re any closer to fucking them than if you were in an igloo in Greenland watching it over a flickering TV signal. I fucked a very hot 17yr old but she was an extreme outlier. Eddie fucked a pretty girl and she was also an extreme outlier. My other (anonymous) buddy fucked a MILF and she was also an extreme outlier. Tom had been a few months earlier and done the same thing.
Sigh, yet another game of “find the outlier”.
Things were different in October. For a start it was cold and rainy, so the streets never had that lets-just-hang-out-because-it’s-fun-to-be-here vibe for the hot girls and the men who chase them. Most of the time the girls were hurrying to be somewhere and trying to keep their street time to a minimum. Gone were the summer days of girls just sitting around on kerbs eating ice cream, gazing absently into space. It also meant that being on the streets took a little out of us because it was so cold.
You’d think that would translate into a shitty daygame trip, but no. It was weird.
For some reason I’d accidentally sprayed on Pussy Catnip and my experience was like the fantasy of the Lynx deodorant advert. For the first five days I was constantly IOI’d. Any given day I’d get at least thirty of them, some of which were head-turning tongue-hanging-out mong looks from younger-hotter-tighter girls. Pretty much every set hooked strong and my phone rapidly filled up. I thought to myself, “Jesus fucking Christ, I’m going to smash this town!”
Alas, it was not to be. I was instead about to get a lesson in the iron self-discipline of Ukranian girls in sticking to their boyfriend script. If Warsaw/Krakow metrics applied, I think I’d have gotten laid every single night of my trip. Instead I banged two new girls. Both hot, both young but also both a pain in the arse to close*. So I was getting half of Pussy Paradise:
Warsaw: Few IOIs, few hotties, but all of them are dirty whores ready to go fast.
Ukraine: Many IOIs, many hotties, but all of them patient value-extractors taking it slow.
It was like getting served a cup of tea without the milk and sugar. What’s the point of that? [or for Americans, it was like getting peanut butter without the jelly]. Many thoughts went through my mind during the first week of the trip. Once the initial disbelief at my reactions died down, I thought:
- This is what it’s like to be Steve Jabba, where literally half the girls in a town get wet just looking at you. I can pick and choose my opens according to who I like best and gives the strongest IOI. No need for a cold approach.
- It wasn’t like this in August
- Why can’t it always be like this? It’s so easy and so much fun.
- What is different that’s causing such a change in pre-open IOIs and the solid hooks?
My brain was working overtime to figure out if there was a way to bottle the magic. By the second week when the flaking epidemic hit, I was wondering if there was in fact any magic to bottle, or if it was fools gold. I still don’t know the answer but I do know the reactions were so extreme and so consistent that there was something different going on. Now I must stress that my end-result laycount was no different to a normal trip. Two girls in three weeks. That’s at the low end of what I consider a decent trip. In Serbia and Belarus trips I’ve trebled that before without resorting to barrel-scraping. Here are my unstructured, unpolished thoughts on what might’ve been going on.
- I’d gotten back into the gym and gained about eight pounds of muscle in 2015 while keeping body fat constant (a bit fat, but not fatter). While in August I had to wear t-shirts and shorts due to the heat, in October I could layer up with a leather jacket so I gained all the advantage of the muscle mass without any of the disadvantages of looking a bit thick around the middle. So, a girl’s initial once-over to clock my body shape was more favourable now.
- My fashion was back to my Overkill style – leather bike jacket, open shirt, t-shirt, accessories, jeans, leather boots, hat. It really stood out against the local men. I literally didn’t see anyone who dressed anything like me. So, my shiniess worked better in cold weather.
- My vibe was absolutely glowing. From the very first day I was in a great mood and the constant stream of good reactions and IOIs just snowballed it. I felt extremely attractive. It felt like walking into a nightclub knowing you’re the best-looking guy there. My cold approach game has been honed through five years of being sexually invisible until I open my mouth. It was nice to play the game on easy mode like a good-looking guy and my vibe responded to create a virtuous spiral.
- My face and body language were extremely open and pure. I never felt like I was wearing a mask or trying to project a certain emotion. I just walked around feeling great and let that radiate outwards. It felt like I’d been carefully cleaning and polishing the lense on my movie projector for years and now it was time to spool the reels and see an image projected with perfect fidelity. Non-players don’t appreciate that this isn’t “being yourself” or “dropping game”. It’s the opposite. Rejecting game / behaviour modelling / identity change means you just lazily whip out your dirty cracked lense and expect the audience to be happy with the shitty image on screen.
- I always followed the principles of my game, but I frequently abandoned the prescriptive model. I’d open girls by shouting at them from ten metres away: “Hey you! Miserable looking girl with the black coat. Stop!” (that was a catwalk model idate – but went nowhere). I’d open by pointing and not saying a word. I even opened three sets. Nothing mattered because I was in full flow and riffing off all the lessons I’d internalised.
But of course despite the unbelievable strength of my initial reactions, things dropped off sharply when it came to getting laid and I was right back to the usual results. Why is that? The major drop off came in two stages. Almost every girl replied to my feeler text but very few came out on dates. Frustratingly, many would keep up a fun flirty exchange, send me (not dirty) photos and then literally just not reply when I sent the date invitation. A few girls messaged me things like “I’m on Khreshatyk street now, let’s meet!” and then when I replied “Ok, outside McDonalds in 15 minutes?” they literally didn’t reply for several days. The other major drop-off came on the date when I went for a kiss. Incredibly, I only kissed four girls, and three of them ended up naked on my bed. The rest rebuffed the kiss.
This is what I think. Again, I’m not sure. The whole experience was like Bizarro World where nothing meant the same as it would mean in any other city I’ve been to.
- I was plugging directly into a girls hindbrain on the street and frying her circuits. This meant I was getting massive attraction from No Girls just from the power of my presence. They’d love it, lap it up, and then return to No Girl status when they cooled down back home. As I write in Daygame Mastery, good street game will make timewasters out of No Girls that would simply blow out a guy with shit game. That’s why you should always be highly suspicious of men with high number-to-date ratios. They are doing pure Yes Girl filtering, punching below their weight.
- My extreme shininess was inducing No Girls to let themselves come out for coffee Day 2 / idates as a diversion to their otherwise routine lives. Many of them had study, homework and part-time jobs so they really don’t do much else any given week. The girls would enjoy the date, thank me for coffee, and go back to their lives unfucked. They knew if they tried to extend it to a second date they’d have to start putting out because I’d subcommunicated my unwillingness to be strung along. So they cashed in their small winnings rather than risk getting fucked while trying to increase their stack of attention chips.
- That same shininess and horniness is why the text exchanges dropped off. They loved the process until the moment they were forced to get off the fence. Being conflict avoidant, girls would rather ghost you than give an overt “no thanks” reply.
- A bunch of girls were attracted to me and available but they wanted a boyfriend. I quickly formed the impression that Kiev girls are either gold-digging bitches (a tiny proportion overall, but vastly more than in any other city) or straight-laced village good girls. The date became a subtle frame-control battle where they held out for me to audition as boyfriend and when I refused, they disengaged because they’d rather have nothing than have casual sex with a stranger. It was all at a I-know-that-you-know level. I set out my stall and she decided the product warranty wasn’t comprehensive enough. I was unwilling to invest additional time in D3s, D4s etc because once the freshness of the first hour with a new girl wears off, dating bores me now. I’d rather just play a video game.
Kiev has a reputation for being a tough city to get laid in (for free). I can go along with that. Most reports are that you get a ton of harsh blow outs while filtering for the rare outlier Yes Girl. I can believe that too. It never happened to me but I saw it happen to most others. I think I reached a higher level of failure – almost non stop good reactions and getting my eventual “No” further down the line.
So, based on my two trips I’m rating Kiev about the same level as Belgrade in that it’s painful and demoralising for beginners (stick to Prague or Berlin guys), a ton of work for rare but decent reward for intermediates, and an addictive mirage for advanced guys who get to sit front row for the Victoria Secrets show close enough to smell their panties but not able to sample the goods as much as you think you’re going to.
I’ll solve the puzzle. For now I’ve opened the enigma and unwrapped the mystery, but the riddle remains.
* I define “pain in the arse to close” as “didn’t display willingness to jump into bed with me two hours after we met”. These days, if I get any kind of resistance to my escalation I switch off and lose interest. I can’t help it. I think it’s my subconscious trying to tell me to stop being a player. I’ll write about it sometime because I think this is probably the biggest negative impact on my 2015 results – I rarely give a shit about the girl in front of me and she smells it. While I still really enjoy the street (probably due to the constant novelty of each girl), everything else gets boring if it doesn’t go exactly my way on exactly my timetable. It’s probably some kind of notch-fatigue. Like Jimmy said to me recently, “Nick, you’ve fucked enough girls.”
November 19, 2015 at 2:45 pm
Nice analysis. Here’s my hypothesis.
You’re creating attraction. The girls are keeping their frame, however. You need to bust their frame and make them feel safe moving into your frame. Prolong the attraction so that the girls want to act on it. You’re getting a spike up, then a quick fall off. I think that a longer attraction period will cause the fall off to take longer. This will cause more girls to abandon their frame. Short term memory lasts about 23 minutes or so. Value will have to be demonstrated somehow on subsequent contacts.
“I rarely give a shit about the girl in front of me and she smells it.”
Yeah, your subcomms are giving this away. Girls won’t feel safe moving into your frame if your subcomms don’t provide comfort.
I’ve blogged about what girls want. One of those things is to be desired by an attractive man. If she doesn’t get that desire, sex is out. Pussy is transactional. No desire for her means that she isn’t getting the required payment for sex. So she will be satisfied with your attention instead of your desire. Women want attention from men as well as to be desired. If women can’t get desire, they will settle for attention. So the girls are gaming you to get attention.
Maybe you need to invest a little more yourself in order to generate your own desire? Maybe you’re becoming a little more demisexual and need to like a girl in order to invest yourself?
You always have interesting posts.
November 19, 2015 at 2:51 pm
Well you’ve learned that you still need to close after ioi’s. I’ve been saying it for years. It’s good to as you talk about it here though of course I’ll still get the negative little haters who say I’m not fall g “properly”.
A note to these malicious know nothing gammas : Whenever you fuck a girl who is hot without paying for it, you’ve demonstrably done it properly.
Ps I don’t get half the girls want I g to fuck me by looking. tomorrow is my 40th birthday.’
November 19, 2015 at 2:59 pm
Pretty much mirrors my experience. Girls like attention and there is no better attention than from a player aka high value male. Once in your presence they are enthralled but once they leave your magnetism always wears off and their logical mind kicks in.
November 19, 2015 at 3:55 pm
Interesting, something where I have quite a bit of relevant and recent experience and enough data to possibly draw some conclusions.
I went to Kiev recently for 4 nights (so really 3 days) with 3 of my daygame buddies from London. Here’s what we found:
Number farming was easy, I got 20 numbers in 3 days + facebooks, my wings got similar
Getting dates was not hard, I got 4 dates
There seem to be hardly any men in Kiev and the ones that are there look awful
Closing was mixed, I got nothing bar a kiss, one wing got a girl back but got LMR. HOWEVER my other 2 wings got laid twice with what you’d probably consider 8’s. Which is both excellent and for me, more than a little demoralizing!
So why did 2 guys get laid and where the other 2 failed? Well it could of course just be down to luck, it could be down to skill, or it could be our style of game. The girls the guys got laid with were a little older, I think 25-29 but still hot, the ones I dated ranged from 17-25 which might have helped. Certainly the most experienced guy there got laid so that could have been skill.
I’d say though that my style of game and the other guy that didn’t notch are both more of the rapid escalation camp, all of my daygame lays have been first date lays and same day lays. The other 2 are probably better at playing the potential boyfriend where needed, one does this well because if he met the right girl he probably would settle down, the other is just Machiavellian. I think the success of the boyfriend strategy is driven by the lack of men in Kiev, all the girls want a boyfriend but being seen as a slut is going to be detrimental to their long term mating strategy, as such they need the illusion at least of potential commitment to fuck. One of the girls said as much her self, something along the lines of “you’re ruined in this town if people find out you’re a slut.”
Fair play to them though, 2 lays in 3 days is epic work so congratulations to Matt and Jonny and commiserations Shane, we’ll crack it next time! I should also add, for the sake of my own massive ego, that I BANGED A GOD DAMN 9 in Budapest a month prior to this trip! [Nice story. What age is each guy and what are their looks? K.]
November 19, 2015 at 5:38 pm
29, 33, 34 and 36. We’re all intelligent and similar in looks in that none of us are classically good looking but we make the most of what we’ve got. At least 3 of us will be at Outlaws on 6th Dec so you can judge for yourself then. [Cool. Come up and say hello during a break. K.]
November 19, 2015 at 5:46 pm
This is a tall story with no evidence. I smell a rat. BANNED. [That’s not the official KrauserPUA position on the matter. K.]
November 19, 2015 at 6:01 pm
November 19, 2015 at 7:31 pm
Evidence can be provided to Mr. K at said event. [Indeed it was. Tom scrolled through a WhatsApp chat with this Hungarian girl and showed a few photos. Based on this plus my own once-over of Tom and his vibe, my conclusion is (i) She likes him (ii) She fucked him (iii) She’s pretty. I think calling her a 9 is an exaggeration – I put her at a low 8 – but she is unquestionably YHT and a good score. Story: Verified. Tom: Not an internet bullshitter. K.]
November 19, 2015 at 8:07 pm
Ha Tom, I’m 35.
First girl was 20 year old, up near the university. She ioi’d me. Evening date following night. Pretty easy, 3 drinks, couple of venues, a walk around the square and straight back to the apartment. I asked her after why she had fucked me. She said because i look different to the local guys.. not hard, they all look like shit. But, i do have a good style, average build, look a bit like a wop but am thank fuck am English.
2nd girl a SDL i got outside McDonalds early evening whilst all the others were on dates Sat night. She started dancing near me by the busker, I saw her eye me up. I almost let her go. But, ran after her and her mate when they started to head off. Went to burger bar, then buddah with both. She was 27, one of the hottest girls i’ve fucked. She’s divorced and works every hour god sends. The key to her was dancing, I used to do salsa. So just threw those moves at her and she melted. Sent her friend off in a taxi. Walked her back to apartment after, told her friend i’d make sure she got home ok… 😉
I’ve been back to Kiev since, this time for 3 days to follow up on 1 of the other leads. She’s more clamped to bf ideal. And most i got was a kiss from her. So i guess this is the *regular kiev girl* She’s hot enough to long game and head back for. I also went out twice with the 27 year old, and banged her twice more. Post sex she admitted she had spotted me on the first night i met her. 😉
I have photos of both, but i’m keeping them. :]
November 19, 2015 at 6:50 pm
In the summer I SDL’d a chaste Moscow 9. A real one, Victoria’s Secret model quality, the type you only spot once per week or less in central Moscow.
I did it through something that most guys here aren’t willing to talk about: rape game. R-selection works like a motherfucker in Russia, but it only works in the moment. If you let her go home and think about it you’re screwed. You need to fuel her up, then weasel her to your house, and resort to calibrated violence and physical pushiness (while preserving the vibe at all costs) in getting her into the apartment and LMR. She really needs to get fully lost in the intensity of the experience. I almost never lose an LMR battle in Russia, no matter the sexual history or mentality of the girl. You must tap into her brain chemistry, which was fully designed to respond sexually to violence. Once you’ve fucked her, you can keep her.
Some of the purple pill men on here can write me saying I’m deranged, but online comments will not disprove my personal experience. [Not sure what to make of this. K.]
November 19, 2015 at 10:57 pm
Anon, I’ll cosign women’s desire to be physically dominated, but I don’t know about rape game. I don’t know about Russia, but I know of a man who spanked his wife hard. The wife hated to be spanked and threatened to call the police. She got so pissed at him that she took off her panties and threw her panties at him shortly after being spanked, then wanted to fuck 3 times in the next 24 hours.
I think that it may require lasering while physically dominating the girl as well as a ZFG and Amused Mastery attitude. Being a psychopath will likely help.
“She really needs to get fully lost in the intensity of the experience.”
“R-selection works like a motherfucker in Russia, but it only works in the moment. If you let her go home and think about it you’re screwed.”
I think that if you spike attraction too quickly, then leave, it sets off ASD alarms. I think that you can spike attraction, but you must stay and continue spiking it for an hour or so, at least until you get the shit tests. Your subcomms need to signal some affection as well as attraction for the attraction to be effective beyond the moment. And expect to have to DHV all over again the next time that you meet.
I spent about seven hours in a group about 6 weeks ago. Met a MILF at the group (Face is a 7, body is a 5). Did a DHV chatting with a friend in the group and MILF overheard. We all got drunk at a vineyard and she and I exchanged nos. (I opened my phone to New Contact, set it in front of her, then walked away as everyone in the group of ten watched. Never said a word. A very ballsy move. Unsurprisingly, ballsy moves usually work for me.) When I returned, she had input her info. Texted her while we were both still somewhat drunk and one of her texts said that she was soaking in the tub. Three days later I texted her, she responded quickly, I asked her a question and she referred me to another broad in the group. A cold response. ASD had set in.
About 4 weeks pass. Today I was in her town which is about an hour from mine–taking my wife to an appt. While waiting, I got fast food breakfast and wanted some entertainment, so I texted MILF at 10:39 a.m. and she replied at 10:40 a.m. She was looking for us to meet up at an upcoming group event next Sun. I have no doubt that she’s DTF. We have rapport (she’s pretty Red Pill and is very open about women’s sexual strategy) and attraction. I told her that I prob wasn’t going. Rapport helped alleviate ASD and so did the comfort from being together in the group and being in the same group at two events for 7 hours.
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November 20, 2015 at 4:07 am
“My fashion was back to my Overkill style – leather bike jacket, open shirt, t-shirt, accessories, jeans, leather boots, hat. It really stood out against the local men. I literally didn’t see anyone who dressed anything like me. So, my shiniess worked better in cold weather.”
Now that it’s been established that standing out matters, it’d be an interesting experiment for a guy to run his game with say, the above, and with some quality GQ style, and again with a sharp business suit. Everything else aside (considerations that it may suggest provider game etc.) would be interesting to see if the latter 2 convert numbers to dates better. For sure those 2 styles would also stand out there [One of my friends did the Hugh Grant movie style. It gets looks. Probably easier to get dates but you are nudging girls to make you wait. K.]
November 20, 2015 at 7:19 am
Whenever I’m struggling with a game issue, you or some other writer would ever so timely post a content that is relevant to my situation.
Amazing how the universe tends to meet you halfway if you’re taking the right course of action.
I’ve been following you for the past 3 years now Nic, been featured on one of your front page posts, bought your products DGM and DGOK. Yet despite all that, going through all my daygame experiences, being a naturally overly analytical wired person, I have a tendency to overthink and get hard on myself. I can cut and paste whats relevant in this post to my situation but that would be unnecessary.
All in all, this post helped me reaffirm how girls are attracted to my verbal game on the street stop (I most do retail stores stops), exchange contact info, whatsapp text back and forth – she disappears into the black hole of daygame – doesn’t respond to invites to come out/excuses of being busy. LIke you said, they love the process but won’t get off the fence when it comes down to it.
Thanks for this post Nic, as always, a timely post for one of your fav readers. [Glad it helps and thanks for your support. K.]
November 20, 2015 at 9:35 pm
“I rarely give a shit about the girl in front of me and she smells it.” I also get bored on dates with girls that aren’t really my type and being a pain in the ass but this also has happened when I am interested in a girl.
Some of the most recent feedback I’ve gotten from girls: A girl text me, “I’m not interested in seeing you again. I got a weird vibe from you.” D4 with a girl who always rejects my escalation, “I feel like you consider girls as a sexual conquest. When we first hanged out I felt like you weren’t interested in getting to know me.” Both girls I was really attracted to and my type but I guess I was focusing on the fast sex too much that It came out as If I didn’t give a fuck about anything but sex. A similarity between the two girls is that they were both going through a breakup.
November 23, 2015 at 3:51 am
Is it possible that it’s time to leverage your achievements to start a new chapter in your life, i.e., settling down and forming a nice white family?
November 25, 2015 at 5:43 pm
How is your russian? I speak basic conversationnal but it tripled my success. It works because it shows you care enough to learn the language. So even if you give the womanizer vibe (wich we all give, being western looking men, why the f*ck else would we be in ukraine), you will be at least a caring womanizer. [Speaking to a girl in a butchered version of her language is a DLV. Your uptick in results is probably just increased confidence rather than the language. Girls don’t decide to fuck you based on your being able to speak simple sentences in their language. I think it’s a waste of time unless you enjoy the act of learning a language. Otherwise it’s a massive timesink compared to either figuring out how to close girls on GoogleTranslate, or just opening 3 times the sets. For example I speak Japanese fairly well but I still wouldn’t use it in Tokyo daygame. It comes across creepy to have learned a language to fuck the girls. Also, I travel between countries that each have a different language. I might try learning some Russian but it would for the convenience of getting around in Russian speaking countries. If you’re living in Russia that’s a different story entirely. K.]