Emerging Talent: An interview with Chaotic Great

June 28, 2014

For the last few months I’ve frequently commented on the apparent conundrum that there are few good daygamers coming up through the ranks. Daygame instruction is the best it’s ever been (and about to get better with some upcoming 2014 releases), the whole path is mapped out…. and yet few success stories.

So allow me to introduce a success story.

I first noticed @chaoticgreat when Rivelino started retweeting him. Over the course of a few months he posts five +1s, all daygame, and one of them an SDL. Hmmmmm….. that’ll make an old hand’s ears prick up. So I got in touch and asked him to share his story of daygame in Madrid. He’s asked me not to give away anything to harm his anonymity so just visualise an early-twenties Spaniard who looks a bit like a local footballer and you’ll get the picture.

Blind yadstop in 3...2...1....

Blind yadstop in 3…2…1….

Qu.1 – Can you tell me a little about how you heard about daygame and what pushed you from “interested” into committing to some approaches?

It all started last summer when by chance I found a manosphere community (The Red Pill subreddit) and began obsessively reading everything I could get my hands on. Thank god I did. For 21 years I had been unaware of how much of chump I had been and how unattractive some of my behaviours were.

As it usually happens, the pendulum swung the other way and I became an narcissistic asshole. I got better with time as my personality came through the dark triad guy I was trying to project. I think this happens to most beginners.

I fell in love with he idea of bettering and after coming back from an study abroad program I began “working on my value”. I would work out, eat well and try to be the alpha guy in the room. But I wasn’t getting laid. I kept telling myself how I needed to look better, be better to get laid. As you’ve mentioned in your blog, this is just an excuse. Since I had always sucked at night game I figured daygame would be more appropriate for my personality and decided to try it out. Quoting porn and masturbation was a big motivation to start doing approaches.

For the first few days I would walk around town weaselling out or doing lame indirect approaches. I knew I wasn’t gonna get laid by asking where the nearest Starbucks was and even though I could talk to girls, I couldn’t seduce them. Everything changed when I contacted Rivelino (@alpharivelino), who I found on Twitter and read was also in Madrid. I met up with him and he showed me how to properly yadstop and taught me the London Daygame Model. Having him as a wing and game teacher was of huge help. Once I got a set of rules to follow and was able to see him approach I felt much more comfortable.

We started daygaming several times a week and still game together. I became obsessed with daygame, going out several times a week sometimes for as long as 7 hours. Now I do around 30 approaches a week.

I recently started recording my sets to get better feedback and see where I can improve. I was able to consistently hit the streets by realising that I was using an excuse not to approach and by finding an experienced daygamer that took me under his wing and pushed me constantly.

Madrid, in my mind

Madrid, in my mind

Qu.2 – You told me you didn’t really have a “beginners hell” phase. Can you talk a little about your early results and what you brought from your normal life that fitted well to daygame?

I had always been a social and outgoing person but wasn’t successful with girls because I kept self-sabotaging myself. I consider myself a good conversationalist and can make people laugh. All of this helped me in the approaches.

Rivelino made sure I wouldn’t weasel out of sets so I lost my approach anxiety in a couple of days. I imagine this is what being on a bootcamp is like. I was able to have fun conversations from the get go and very soon started getting numbers. Those first sets weren’t that good but it didn’t matter. The approach itself was such a display of courage to the Spanish girls that even boring conversations without clear intent would result in numbers.

I was lucky to get early validation and that pushed me to continue. Having great logistics helped too. Mostly because I couldn’t use it as an excuse not to escalate and felt like I had to take advantage of my living situation. I never went through a period of absolutely sucking and the rush of walking up to the girls and getting some smiles was becoming extremely addictive. External validation hits, as Riv calls them.

I feel like all the right pieces were there, I just needed to focus my attention on approaching and following the model.

Qu.3 – Let’s have a story about the first time you realised you could bang some hot girls and became a Daygame Believer. Also, contrast it with an example of a really frustrating failure.

I became a believer by reading blogs like yours. Field reports of SDLs and bathroom sex stories. I was never skeptical of the efficacy of game and was getting numbers and good reactions from girls early on so I knew it was possible.

It was probably after my first daygame lay that I viewed it as a very valid and efficient way to have sex with quality girls.

The funny thing is that this first lay could also be considered one my most frustrating failures. She was a very hot Romanian girl in her late twenties. She had a great body and a very sexy walk. I did what Rivelino calls a “blind yadstop” and approached her having only seen her back. My mindset was to just talk to her to become comfortable with the hotter girls, I expected nothing to get out of it.

She spoke no English and knew very little Spanish. We communicated mostly through Google Translate, which allowed me plenty of time to come up with good responses to shit tests. Since I couldn’t say much all I did was look intensely at her while repeating “I’m gonna fuck you” in my head. It worked!

We met up and after some awkward moments where she kept saying I was rude (which I now view as a good sign) and failed escalations I was able to get her back to my place. Things seemed to be progressing nicely but I was very nervous. I wasn’t quite sure how to make it happen and decided to follow the advice on the book (Daygame Mastery that is) and picked her up and threw her on the bed (I almost fell on a coffee table with her in my arms hahah). Laying on top of her I could hear my mind saying “what if you don’t get hard?” and, of course, went completely limp instantly. Fuck! Not as embarrassing as I thought because she was blaming herself for not being able to turn me on. Fascinating how insecure every woman is regardless of her looks. Imagine having a hot Romanian looking at you with puppy eyes asking “me not sexy for you?”. Poor girl.

Anyways I tried doing some mediation and relaxation exercises but couldn’t seem to get it up. I convinced her to suck on my limp dick and see if the stars would align. I got a half decent erection and decided to go for it mostly to make it count. To finally be able to say I banged a girl from daygame. I wanted the reference experience for future lays. I couldn’t feel much with the condom on and explained and convinced her to try raw and see if it would help. It didn’t really but showed how a turned on woman can be easily convinced. The whole thing seemed like an awkward American Pie sex scene and after a while I told her to leave and that we should try some other time. Huge sexual failure but great daygame progress. It was my first complete run of the model so I wasn’t too devastated by the whole thing.

A couple of days passed and I noticed red spots on the head of my dick. WTF. I’m scared shitless and go to see my urologist as soon as I could. Turns out the bitch gave me a yeast infection. Fucking cunt. I treated it for a month and it was gone but that month all I could think is how much of an idiot I was for not wrapping it up.

Artist's impression, yesterday

Artist’s impression, yesterday

A few weeks later I bumped into her walking with her mom during a daygame session. It was a nice reminder of how crazy your life can become once you start hitting the streets.

As for other failures, I remember getting some LMR from an American girl (24) that had gone a year without sex with my hand rubbing her pussy and her panties dripping. She then explained how her previous bf had to wait a year and a half to fuck her. There is no way to know you’re gonna fuck for sure. Getting her number means nothing, making out with her means nothing, only fucking her makes you know for sure. This has been a big discovery for me and it’s helped tons to drop all expectations of what could happen.

It was also frustrating to spend time with a cute Russian teen (19) that ended up being a complete waste of time. She was just sad and depressed and wanted someone to hang out with. She had no personality, no opinions on anything and was a complete downer. What bothered me wasn’t not fucking her it was thinking of the opportunity cost of spending time with her. I could have been day gaming getting more leads!


Thanks ChaoticGreat for the insight. Part two to follow soon……


June 25, 2014

While camping under the open sky one morning, the twinkling stars in the grey velvet night giving way to the first red rays of dawn over the hilltop, the soft tweets of a birdsong carried across the wind. Deep in the forest birds conducted their elaborate dance without a care for human ears. I sat and listened as I put a kettle on the stove. How musical!

Back in civilisation and wifi range I did a little sleuthing* on these birds, having considered the purpose of the birdsong. It would appear the birdsong has developed as a mating strategy amongst certain birds. And it’s clever.

"You look very..... French"

“You look very….. French”

The normal male birds range widely to forage for twigs and leaves that will make an impressive nest. Throughout winter these males work, gradually slotting each element into the construction until a grand nest is complete. I imagine even in such a little bird-brain the male feels tremendous satisfaction upon the culmination of his labours. He has created something out of nothing! Now, his little bird breast puffed out he seeks a female to install into his nest.

The females didn’t do much in winter. Their role is not nest-building. They simply wait for the males to finish and then perform a tour of the nests, much like the Queen inspecting her guards. The male bird who has foraged best and created the most impressive nest earns the honour of the female taking up residence. The mating ritual is almost complete.

from MTV Nests

from MTV Nests

Within this species is another mating strategy. The song birds don’t build nests. They don’t forage a metre further than they need for their own sustenance. Rather, the songbird spends his time perfecting his beautifully melodic singing voice. And with good reason.

While the nest-building males are showing off their real estate, the songbird males are showcasing their vocal talents. And the females have a weakness for singing. It would appear that there is an exploit within the female bird’s brain that would make Internet Explorer 8 blush. That female brain is not properly secured with it’s AntiSong software. So the songbird sings and the female at first pays slight attention. That attention soon becomes rapt, she’s intrigued. Before long she’s enraptured by the melodic tweets. The songbird ups the ante until he’s rogering the female, passing his DNA to the next generation to be raised in another male’s nest.

Nature has it’s own K and R selection strategies.

This is the point about Game. It’s fine to earn money, travel, build social circles, dress in suits or whatever else the “get your shit together” blogs recommend. That’s an impressive nest for a female to take a guided tour of. But while you’re dicking around with that, other men are working on their Song.

You can’t keep your female in the nest 24/7. She keeps hearing the beautiful melody carried across the wind, wondering who is singing. She’ll venture out. And then, much faster than it takes to build a nest, she’ll be seduced and enraptured**

Flown the nest

Flown the nest

Game is a trojan horse that detects and exploits weaknesses in a woman’s No Filter. All day every day a hot young girl is under attack from male mating strategies, be it the omnipresent orbiter, the promotion-with-strings manager, the helpful neighbour, or the back alley rapist. Evolution has equipped her with a strong anti-virus software – the No Filter – to rebuff these attacks so she can retain control of the mating ritual and make it work for her to get what she wants. Evolution never prepared her for Game – the deliberate and practiced study of charisma, custom-designed to defeat that No Filter. It’s like a weaponised virus attacking a common immune system.

You can only build one nest, and few females are willing to share it with rivals. The birdsong is song across the entire forest and all surrounding fields, luring the females out of their nests just long enough to notch them. If only somebody had written a book on Birdsong Mastery you could dispense with all the nest-building bullshit.

* Long enough to find this link, and that’s it. Didn’t bother reading past the fourth paragraph. I have no idea if the biology is correct.

** Probably fucked in the disabled toilets of Charing Cross Hotel at 4pm.

*** Credit to Bodi for putting the birdsong name onto the concept.


Street stop infield: Subtle r-selection in action

June 19, 2014

Good daygame is not about bells and whistles, salsa spins and silly pranks. That’s just feeding the YouTube clowns who watch a fuckwit / charlatan and don’t even know what they are seeing. Good daygame is not about standing still and making inane chit chat either, unless you’re top 5% in looks and happy getting girls below you in SMV.

If you want girls younger-hotter-tighter you have to lead the chat, demonstrate value, move her through the stages and do it all without appearing to be performing. It’s tough.

My recent efforts have been to subtley embed the lessons of lover/provider (or r/K selection) into the mechanics of an infield stop. I’m making a discreet and well-calibrated sexual proposition to the girl in the hope she’s step out for some adventure sex. Everything about me has to project the same signal: Adventure Sex Guy. So I need to align:

  • fashion
  • body language
  • vibe
  • verbal content
  • decision making

Thus I have a bad boy style with rings, chains and biker boots. I stand confident and cocky while my eyes shine and my mouth smirks. I’m sexually intense and unapologetic in expressing it. I turn the conversation sexual with innuendo, teasing and leading. And I make decisions that lead to fast sex not dating (hopefully!).

I haven’t recorded much in Belgrade because it takes me out of the moment. I think the few legit daygamers have already put enough good infields up on YouTube already. But here’s one from a couple of days ago. I’ve added captions to explain some of what I’m doing.

The main things to take from this audio are:

  • The r-selection gets tested when she mentions her boyfriend. Watch how I deal with it.
  • Try to spot all the subtle fractionation in matched pairs of push/pull, sexually on/off, talking/listening, stupid/smart etc.

Haven’t fucked her yet. Still swapping texts to see if I can take her at the flood.

To learn this style of daygame, check out my books Daygame Nitro (intermediate) and Daygame Mastery (advanced)

The Supply Problem Scarcity Reversal Girl

June 16, 2014

Men have so many wrong ideas about women. That’s natural, because we’re in a different sexual role and we all fall prey to projection. One common wrong-headed idea is to see a really hot girl and think:

She must have so many options!

Women are all about the quality of options, not the number. We can see a girl post an attention-whoring selfie on Facebook to draw 100 likes and fill her chodestream. Wow, so many options! No, that’s projection. If a man drew 100 likes from girls he’d naturally assume 90 of them want to fuck him (and he’d be right) and he’d then start mining the seam of all the pretty ones. The girl’s problem is that those likes are low quality attention. It validates her but doesn’t solve her pressing sexual needs.

She wants high quality male attention and that’s a scarce resource. She can’t draw it with a selfie.

How dare she!

How dare she!

All girls have an Attraction Threshold below which the men are insignificant and might as well be furniture. Above that threshold are the “hot” and “interesting” men. The specifics of this depend on the girl. Some like jacked young douchebags. Some like mature men with gravitas. Some are all about the money and handbags. Each girl has her particular preferences and only certain men meet them and rise above the threshold.

Once you’re above her threshold you are now a scarce resource. She won’t just blow you off, ignore your texts and so on (except as a tactic in the mating dance). Some girls have an exceedingly high (or exceedingly narrow) attraction threshold and those girls seem difficult until you figure it out. The process is actually very simple:

  1. Girl has unusually specific requirements in her man. For example if she’s a tall, intelligent fashion model with family money she’ll be very specific because so many pillars of her innate hypergamy can’t be easily found in one man.
  2. All day every day, the men she meets don’t come close to her attraction threshold. She never meets the man who makes her ears perk up. On the rare cases it happens, something happens on the date to burst the bubble and disappoint her.
  3. After years without sex she gives up on men. Her sex drive goes into hibernation and she focuses all her attention on other pursuits.
  4. She’s dismissive of the men who hit on her. She has a learned helplessness – “I’ll waste my time and emotional investment getting to know this man and inevitably be disappointed. So why bother. Just screen them out. I’ll never find a man. Better not to look. It’ll just depress me.”
  5. You come along. She’s perked up and tries to No-Filter you to oblivion. She seems to difficult. What a bitch.
  6. You persevere. You’re a trained player and this is a puzzle you might be able to solve. Finally, against her better judgement, frustration and hope put her on a Day 2 with you.
  7. After an initially frosty and defeatist beginning, she starts to warm to you. She’s enjoying this. She doesn’t really know what to do. She’s never been on a date so long without something going wrong.
  8. And then – ping! – something happens and her defeatism falls away. She realises you are not fucking up. “This man might actually be what I’ve been dreaming about all these barren years”
  9. “Fuck! He is! Finally, a man I can fuck!”

And then it’s in the bag. You are the scarcest of resources. All of that pent-up horniness bubbles up and the volcano explodes. The girl will now chase you. You are the only one who can deliver her. And just like that – often there’s a very particular easy-to-see moment on the date – she flips 180 from being a dismissive, difficult princess to her being a total chode.

 * EDIT – I probably didn’t make it clear enough but I’m talking about a particular sub-category of girl here (the “supply problem” girl) who has very little sex because of her excessively restrictive standards. I’ve laid a bunch of them who haven’t had sex in as much as four years before meeting me and all had tiny lay counts. These girls loved sex, they just struggled to find someone who could switch them on. So I’m describing the process I noticed when dating them. If you meet a girl who hasn’t had sex in over six months but who clearly isn’t frigid, she might be one of these. During the questions game, asking “when did you last have sex” is an easy way to probe.

The r-selected international playboy

June 13, 2014

I know I’m labouring the point but it’s important to repeatedly stress the benefits of leaping from the K-selection ladder to the R-selection stratosphere. They are two different worlds with completely different rules. There are a couple of good bloggers who live the international man of mystery lifestyle. I like what they are doing. They’ve unplugged and are giving detailed advice on how to follow in their footsteps. Sometimes their material is downright inspirational.

artist's impression

artist’s impression

But I think it confused r/K somewhat. What they recommend is different to what I do. So allow me to split some hairs and explain the difference*

I’ve spent one month in a pleasant FSU city, all of it in the Old Town. That’s a small place where you constantly run into the same people over and over. I’m constantly bumping into girls I know while another girl is on my arm. Let me list them chronologically**:

  1. Jelena is a long-term rotation girl who I bang every time I visit, since mid-2012. She doesn’t have a boyfriend and is focused on her new career, so I’m the sex guy she comes to for a rogering that won’t otherwise upset her life pattern. First night I arrived in town she came round and I took her anal virginity. A week later I fingered her in a cafe.
  2. Anya is a Russian I closed in Estonia last November. She flew down the first weekend of my trip for a three day visit. She’s back home now, pestering me for the next trip.
  3. Jovanna is a folk singer I closed December 2012 and has been something of a primadonna since. On a whim I messaged her when I arrived and she was in town so we had coffee and made out. A week later she’s back in town so we fuck. I’m now her sex guy when she’s in town.
  4. Milicia is a young student who I opened in my first week. She didn’t reply to my feeler text until I’m walking through a park with Anya and bump into her sitting on a bench with her boyfriend. Now she messages me, we have a date a couple of days later, and a booty call one day later. She’s now a fuck buddy.
  5. Bojana is a young girl I opened last year on a residential with Tom. Occasional FB chat because she likes me but has a boyfriend of four years. I get her on a date and bang her within an hour. She’s since bumped into me when I’m with Natalija and Vedrana. She doesn’t care, still wants to see me.
  6. Dragana is a thirty-year old girl who has barely had sex. I open her this trip, escalate hard on the date, and booty call her next date for the close. I told her I’m a player and she’s still pestering me for casual sex.
  7. Natalija is a 19 year old fashion model with a long-distance boyfriend she met when she was 16 and her only prior sexual partner. I banged her on the second date and now she’s a fuck buddy. Last time I fucked her she said “you should give my boyfriend sex lessons”
  8. Radmila is a 26 year old girl who dated me three days before going on a one-month holiday with her boyfriend. She said she’d had sex a couple of days before our date but I still took her home that night. She’s asking if I’ll still be here when she gets back.
  9. Vedrana is a 22 year old virgin I met on the same 2013 residential with Tom. She was scared but let me take her virginity last week. Before that happened, she bumped into me while I was with Anya.
  10. Marija is an 18 year old who I had on my bed sucking my cock on the second date. Three hours before the booty call sex date she messaged me “I can’t see you for a while, my boyfriend found out”. We are still messaging, waiting for it to blow over.
"Do you have an hour spare later today?"

“Do you have an hour spare later today?”

I have a tendency to preen on this blog but note some key points.

  • Four of these girls had boyfriends and step out on them to fuck me. A fifth is highly likely. They all talk like it’s matter-of-fact and no big deal.
  • Three of these girls “caught” me with other girls and didn’t complain. Twice it was before the sex and they came to me anyway. One of those was a virgin.
  • All of these girls are using me as their “good sex guy” and don’t make any demands on my time other than the sex.
  • I’ve been here one month. I haven’t been clubbing, I don’t have any local friends or “connects”.

This is completely different to the K-selected idea of an MLTR. I don’t have to tell lies to any of them. I make it clear I’m a player and then don’t rub their noses in the details. There are no dinner dates, walks around the park and except for Anya I never hold their hands in public. I’m not installing these girls into apartments like mistresses, buying them iPads, or establishing a position in their social circles. I’ve not met a single friend or family member of any of them. The entire relationship is a one-on-one discreet secret. We share affection and connection – we have true moments of the Love Bubble, it’s not “empty sex” – but it’s not a boyfriend/girlfriend thing.

It’s okay to have K-selected MLTRS, it’s just that for my personality type it’s such a……. ball ache. If you can communicate from the very first seconds of the street stop that you’re the Lover then that’s the track you’ll stay on the whole time. Girls have a severe disconnect between Lovers and Providers. Don’t mix the signals. Project R-selection and then you can cut through all of the bullshit that surrounds a K-selection relationship.

Just imagine…. no more time dicking around learning the local language, no social circle obligations taking you away from CounterStrike, no stupid salsa nights, and no looking over your shoulder in case one girl busts you on a date with another.

My priority, yesterday

My priority, yesterday

So decide what you want. If you want a long-term boyfriend-girlfriend / sponsor-moll / daddy-girl relationship then go the K-route and do not feel ashamed of it. That route give a certain experience that can be very fullfilling, especially if you’re a man who prioritises affection needs. If the lifestyle I just outlined is more your thing then you must go the r-selection route.

To learn how to meet girls on the r-selection path, consider my textbook Daygame Mastery

* and if I’ve misconstrued your message, feel free to correct me in the comments.

** names changed, obviously.


The Daygame Monomyth

June 13, 2014

Writing shortly after the carnage of World War Two ceased, Joseph Campbell released The Hero With A Thousand Faces. He contended that there is a fundamental narrative that is told and retold throughout the great stories of history. Beginning with Bart Homer and stretching forwards to airport bookstore paperbacks and Kung Fu Panda, there is one story – the “monomyth” – rooted deep in the human need for storytelling.

A hero ventures forth from the world of common day into a region of supernatural wonder: fabulous forces are there encountered and a decisive victory is won: the hero comes back from this mysterious adventure with the power to bestow boons on his fellow man

That sounds kinda familiar……

The monomyth has been hard-coded into screen-writing advice given to Hollywood scriptwriters – have you ever noticed how every big movie seems to follow the same structure? They call it the Eight Point Story Arc but it’s just a stripped-down monomyth. Some Hollywood writers have even self-consciously structured their movie around Campbell’s model. Consider this comparison (source article here, I recommend you read his full discussion):

Monomyth 1

Monomyth 2

Monomyth 3

I contend that, due to some combination of evolution and cultural tradition, we naturally try to insert ourselves into a personalised monomyth. Read this next section and consider the typical “player’s journey” story, be it this blog or of course Neil Strauss’s famous work of fiction biography.

In a monomyth, the hero player begins in the ordinary blue pill world, and receives a call reads Roissy to enter an unknown world of strange powers game and events hot girls. The hero chode who accepts the call to enter this strange world start cold approaching must face tasks and trials rejection, either alone or with assistance an approach coach. In the most intense versions of the narrative (Tom Torero / Nick Krauser), the hero must survive a severe challenge, often with help. If the hero survives, he may achieve a great gift or “boon” intermediate game. The hero must then decide whether to return to the ordinary world with this boon start writing a blog or coaching. If the hero does decide to return, he or she often faces challenges on the return journey haters. If the hero returns successfully, the boon or gift may be used to improve the world fund a location-independent income from which to euro-jaunt forever.

There’s a reason we insert ourselves into the monomyth. We all like to self-aggrandise and mythologise our own journeys. Not only does it feel good but – more importantly – it cloaks a timid and highly unpredictable challenge with an air of inevitability. When watching movies we see the hero get into desperate straits and feel the dramatic tension but we know he’ll get out of it. Half of the excitement is waiting to find out what ingenious wheeze he’ll use to solve the problem.

The monomyth is a great meta-level inner game hack. By inserting ourselves into a grand narrative, the result of which is pre-determined, we calm all those “can I really make it?” voices that may otherwise cause us to give up.

Embrace the monomyth. Create your own. Let the power of mythology push you through the hard times and into the Final Act of….. younger, hotter, tighter.

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