Entourage game is for suckers

December 15, 2011
krauserpua

Five or so years ago Adam Lyons made a big name for himself proferring a new type of game system called Project Entourage. The best-case scenario looks like this:

  1. Arrange with nightclub managers to have a guest list you can add names to. Pick one of the beta-wallet-emptying pretentious clubs around the West End such as Movida, China White, Mahiki etc which charge men £20 entry and girls free before 11pm. For every girl you bring you get paid £5. Bring more than 5 girls and you get a VIP table with a complementary bottle of vodka.
  2. Go out daygaming on the afternoon of the night in question. Approach lots of girls with indirect social openers, preferrably tourists who are unlikely to know the nightlife but are keen to go out. “PR-close” them by offering them free entry and drinks to a good club. Hide sexual intent.
  3. Mass text all girls later that night and arrange to meet them all in a nearby pub. Tell them to bring friends.
  4. Socialise a bit in the pub and then lead a train of girls into the club and comped through to the VIP section. You are preselected to every girl in the club and to the girls in your group. Spend the evening drinking free vodka, joking around with girls, pulling random other girls from the dancefloor.
  5. At the end of the night choose your favourite girl who is IOIing you for sex. If you’re really good, have threesomes foursomes and moresomes.
  6. Rinse-repeat every week as your entourage grows bigger and the club begins to finance your lifestyle.

The Dream

Sounds awesome right? According to his own marketing literature Adam was regularly rolling into clubs with 50 hotties in his ho’train and banging millions of them. Let’s ignore for a moment the zero-to-hero bullshit of the AFC Adam story and all the pieces left out (i.e. he was already a well-connected PR party organiser as his job before he started game, that he’s a good looking guy, and that the only public domain evidence of Project Entourage is severely underwhelming). The marketing would have you believe all this success derives simply from playing a basic method of networking the value of a club to the value of a hot woman while you sit in the middle. There’s only one problem.

It’s a load of bullshit. Entourage game is for suckers. Allow me to explain.

  1. Nightclub managers are usually double-dealing cunts who will happily throw you under a bus if a better deal comes along five minutes later. In order to get to a position where they cut you any slack at all you must be really good and bring them a stream of money. The clubs themselves are horrible soul-destroying places full of vacuous dappy tarts and higher-beta chodes trying to impress each other without having any fun. Drinks are £10 a pop so you are basically spending your evenings in someone elses gaudy loud sweaty basement.
  2. PR-closes are basically bribery-closes. You are getting the girl along by playing the role of conduit between the nightclub and her, offering her monetary value. No-one respects PR men precisely because they are the low-value monkeys running around the streets trying to hustle girls into clubs. It is positioning yourself below the girl, not above, and setting yourself up as a provider to be used. The feeling of PR-closing girls is no different to being a telesales guy – it’s no fun at all.
  3. You get more flakes than normal daygame. The girls who do come are self-selecting as party girls. They show no commitment because you are offering them a free lunch and asking nothing back. Zero investment.
  4. The pub stage is like herding cats. Some of the girls will wander off on a whim because they know they can get into the club for free without you. If you’re lucky you’ll have a few decent conversations where you can build comfort and attraction but the big moment of disheartenment comes at….
  5. Girls hang around your VIP table till the free drinks arrive and then the moment its finished the disappear onto the dancefloor. Thirty seconds of arm-waving and their value sky-rockets and the chodes descend on them. You’ll be lucky to see the girls again. Well done, you’ve just done a ton of work to feed these girls to the chodes.
  6. Without a strong reason for your social circle to exist, it disintegrated and you rarely see the girls a second time.

The dizzy heights of success...

I won’t deny there are people who make entourage game work but they are a tiny minority and they spend their lives in nightclubs as they gradually become weirder and weirder people. Surrounding yourself with value-takers and dickheads, experiencing your women at their most superficial will harden you (that high-heeled tourist at your table might actually be a sweet well-rounded person if you dated her in a coffee shop, but in the club she’s a dappy tart overloaded with male attention and flashing lights). A couple of my wings learned entourage game from such a guy – a guy who actually made it work for him – and quickly became disillusioned. It surprised me when they first told me its a load of shit. They regalled me with stories of running around the streets late evening like blue-arsed flies, being treated with barely-concealed contempt from women, arguing with the door-whore to get free entry, then watching other guys steal the women, then wandering home at 4am wondering why you bothered. These are guys with good game who worked hard and learned from one of London’s top nightgamers.

Lets think for a moment why you wouldn’t even expect Entourage Game to work

Normal daygame works because of the value you show and the nature of the interaction. You are stopping girls in daylight while sober in a situation conducive to making good conversation and getting to know each other quickly, before instant dating to build deep rapport. The girl is impressed with your confidence and social savvy as you create something out of nothing while also keying into her social programming of how she’d like to meet a guy. You are the value. Contrast this with a PR close in which she doesn’t perceive confidence because there is no open intent, you frame yourself as a conduit of someone else’s value (the nightclub owners) and act like a low-status employee. Most PR closes are very short interactions of about five minutes and thus you don’t build the thought patterns and emotions in the girl that make her like you. If you did, you wouldn’t bother adding her to the entourage you’d just date her normally. She walks away from a PR-close thinking “fake social guy, to be used if I feel like clubbing”. She is not invested in you.

When you take such a flimsy connection to the club and dilute it with five or ten other girls (that’s a good night – fifty girls is magical thinking) you never get that sit-face-to-face-build-connection phase that is so crucial to pulling non-sluts. Your relations remain superficial and economic so she feels no social or emotional obligation to you. You are simply the guy who gets her through the front door and her first drink for free. You may as well be a hotel porter. So she walks into the club and gets her drink, probably enjoying the experience. But what have you done – you have brought a girl who don’t control into an environment full of competing males (many of whom will buy her drinks), a dancefloor she can spend the night on, music too loud to talk to her, and her sexual value will be the highest if has been all week. Of course you’re going to lose her to the myriad distractions of the club.

It's nowhere near as nice in reality

Compare that to taking the same girl on a one-on-one mid-afternoon coffee/park date that stretches into an evening drink. Before the sun sets you know each other well and she feels like she’s your friend and in your reality. On the unlikely occasion some chode hits on her in the bar, she’s already spent three hours connecting with you and social etiquette requires her to blow him out even if she fancies him.

It remains a golden rule of game that girls will sleep with you if your value exceeds their attraction threshold. Normal daygame provides a vehicle to meet women in optimum circumstances to display high personal charismatic value and monopolise her attention until you have a sufficient hold on her that other suitors are at a huge disadvantage in their attempts to steal her. Entourage game positions you as a dwarf on someone else’s mountain and minimises your circumstances to show personal value while maximising the opportunities for other guys to steal her.

There’s no shortcut to sex with high quality women. Sitting them in someone else’s shitty noisy basement doesn’t raise your chances. So if I think it’s a waste of time for a guy with my priorities who is it actually a good idea for? I would say if several of the following statements apply to you then give it a go:

  • I enjoy going to nightclubs. I might as well get in for free and try something new
  • I usually do well SNLing party girls and fancy trying a different way of getting them
  • I want to try my hand at all different types of game
  • I have a huge ego and the thought of calling ten girls “my entourage” appeals to me even if they don’t consider themselves my girls
  • I want to have sex with lots of girls but don’t want to work hard building my own value, so I’ll be happy with the occasional drunken six

Disclaimer

I’m talking about the specific method of using Entourage Game. None of this applies to guys who build a good social circle around genuine value or who meet lots of hot women socially due to other reasons (e.g. a fashion photographer) and then roll into a club with all their genuine friends.

21 Comments

  1. The entourage gameplan is perfect except of points 2-3, and then it only makes sense if organizing parties and making money from them is your thing. As a shortcut to get laid it will fail for all the obvious reasons – wrong frame etc. Its also the reason points 2-3 suck.

    If you love throwing parties and enjoy dealing with pub´s managements and get an adrenaline rush out of it and cant stop thinking what your next event is going to be about, AND, you are also working on your game, social game, inner game, and utilizing this parties stuff to grow yourself, then after a few parties a social circle will form around you, and you’ll be banging girls like a rockstar, with all the drama-related rockstar partying style included.

    [I agree. In this case you are the value, you are doing what you love, and the method is just a vehicle to convey it. These criteria considerably narrow the field for who it will work for. K.]

    • There is very little game advice about throwing parties with lots of girls (I’ve looked specifically for it). It may perhaps be because it is quite simple, but still; where can I find more information about this? I’ve read short bits of info like this praising throwing parties but where are the details?

      I want to do it exclusively with girls from university/college.

  2. “I’ll be happy with the occasional drunken six”

    Make it seven.

  3. That style of game works best on college campuses, when you are throwing your own private parties.

  4. So if you´re throwing parties dont go PR yourself. PR is not daygame. Awful combination. Instead create hype about the night, and make it a cyclic event, say, second thursday of every month. Make it a business. Hire a bunch of half naked hotties to do the PR. Then you can bang these too. Ah, memories!

  5. “In this case you are the value, you are doing what you love, and the method is just a vehicle to convey it. These criteria considerably narrow the field for who it will work for. K.”

    Yep!

  6. I had a look at the website : http://www.projectentourage.com… what a bunch of c**ts. The most amusing part of it is that I’ve been invited to Chinawhites for a party tomorrow – not been since 2006, and I have a funny feeling I might be heading home on the last tube, so I can get some good nights kip for Saturday’s DG prowl.

  7. K superb post from you mate – we think alike on the subject of nightclubs and entourage. I remember reading about entourage game from Lyons a few years back and thinking what a piece of shit it was.

    Really only to be used by those who get a buzz from the nightclub scene and I am quite sure that the majority of aspirant daygamers reading your blog will be of the inately introverted/higher IQ type that naturally gravitate away from nightgame to daygame despite the initially higher barrier to entry (higher AA, the socially perceived unaturalness of opening during the day, lack of alcohol crutch etc).

    Do seem to remember a post from your mate Torero advocating this shit, with accompanying picture of him surrounded by a load of over 30 dyed blondes – how did that turn out for him?

    • Yeah I was going to ask you Torero – I also remember a picture of him looking like a lounge-lizard no so long ago…

      I seem to recall that you also had a go at this earlier in your ‘career’ with that fashion party thing you did. The post of that party sounded like fun, but I remember thinking that there was no way I was going to hold that kind of lifestyle down whilst building a business. It seems like a lot more effort than inviting a disorientated tourist to afternoon tea, not to mention the soulless self-esteem crush it must eventually become…

      [The fashion parties thing was closer to what Yohami talked about. We put on genuine events - catwalk show, free drinks for whole venue, networking etc. It worked well and Jimmy cleaned up with the models because he provided real value and it was his event. We let it slide because dealing with fashion people is a huge pain in the arse. K.]

  8. I’m loving your post Nick, though i have to disagree on a few thing with regards to entourage game.
    I know Adam personally, having first met him and being invited to his entourage a few years ago and he’s been a massive influence as well has helped put me in the right direction.

    I think what many people seem to misunderstand in his style of game is that they think you have to be a nightclub promoter in order to get girls. The actual fact is, it works in any social situation, not just night clubs. Adam simply picked the night club venue because he wanted hot party chicks.

    Entourage game works in cinemas, house parties, salsa bars and pretty much any venue that contains a host of people. It even works in Day game!

    The key skill that you learn is how to generate social proof which is a powerful skill to know and can effectively generate it where ever you go.

    There is a much bigger game being played beyond the surface level stuff that the majority of guys know. And that’s understanding and being able to influence and shape your environment to your advantage. It’s a concept call ‘metagame’. Do a search on it on youtube. [I know and agree with this bit. K.]

    I’m seeing it for myself at first hand week after week at the salsa event i go to on Friday’s. Salsa is a passion of mine and a great hobby. Due to going every week as well as understanding how social proof works, i can clearly see how powerful it is. As a result, i’ve met the most nicest and down to earth girl ever, and all without not doing more than simply showing up and talking to people. [I've noticed the same thing when I did salsa]

    It’s not about collecting bottle hoes and inviting them out to a club. It’s much more than that. It’s understanding the dynamics of a venue and using it to your advantage. [That's how it's marketed. You seem to be defending a different thing to what I was attacking. All your points are correct, but this is not "entourage game" as I defined it and Adam marketed it. As an aside, having seen Adam first-hand, where do you rate his real results vs his marketed results?]

    Onder

    • I rate him as one of the best PUAs i’ve ever seen. The fact that he’s able to break down everything and make it teachable is remarkable. I know the things he teaches works because having studied it myself, i can clearly see the dynamics in my interactions. It’s not made up theory.
      For someone to figure this out is a testament to his skills. Aside from that, he’s a great guy and is always trying to find ways to give as much value as possible.
      I don’t really have anything bad to say about him.

      I hope that answers your questions
      [That sounds good, but I meant have you seen him in action with girls he was fucking, how hot were they, and how did the interactions go? His teaching material is in the public domain so I already know about that. K.]

      • As you know, everyone’s personal preference on looks is different, but generally all of the girls i’ve seen when i was out at entourage was very good. Because social proof is a form of passive game, Adam was able to engineer a situation where the girls would come to him, so whenever i saw him live in action, it was always impressive as most of the them were heavily invested from the beginning.

        Saying that, i’ve never seen him live in field cold approaching on the streets but have seen a video demo. That’s the only thing i can say with regards to proof.

        The fact is, most of the things he knows and is able to teach is practically impossible to ever know without experience and real world practice. So i have no doubt his abilities.

        I am also good friends with a few of his former entourage wings and they also attest to the same thing and are successful in their own right.

  9. This explains a strange site I saw a few weeks ago on Argyll Street – a man emerging from the Argyll Arms with a dozen women and heading over to Movida. I did wonder whether I was supposed to be impressed but I wasn’t. He seemed barely in control (lol @ “herding cats”) and more to the point I’ve been to Movida twice, when my employer was paying and the first 5 drinks were free. We had the place to ourselves until 10pm and it was fun because it was ours. But after 10 the general public arrived and I realised that there is no way I would ever spend my own money in there on a non-company night.

    It summed up the phrase you used to descibe ‘Flirt on the run’ – a god-awful money pit. Girls show up early (I understand now) and sat around in groups looking gormless taking pictures of each other with their phones to relieve the boredom. Some seem to have one man in their company – almost invariably effeminate looking. The few straight guys who showed up were like characters from Reggie Perrin. Just dreadful.

  10. Great post.

    I think there are 3 real problems with entourage game:

    1 ~ Even if a low value guy somehow managed to get a group of random girls to come to his VIP table, there would be no real reward for him.

    There is no such thing as social proof. If you take a needy guy out with you in a large group of attractive women, those women are perfectly capable of assessing his individual value, and going how with the cool guys in the group while safely ignoring him.

    If you take this needy guy out with you loads of times, make him friends with you and all your friends, give him a fun life, and build up his self confidence, then he will start getting laid a bit more.

    2 ~ If you don’t have much value then trying to run a PRing business will be a massive struggle to actually get the girls to come and you will quickly give up on it. So entourage game is of no use to a guy who is not getting laid much. And bribing the girls to come with free drinks won’t work for the reasons which you sharply articulated in your post.

    3 ~ If you are a cool enough guy (have enough value) to get a bunch of random girls to come out to a nightclub with you, then you are a cool enough guy with enough value to have your own proper group of friends for meeting girls, or to meet them through daygame, or through chatting to girls in bars at night, or in a dozen other ways.

    The reward in terms of girls for a guy who has value isn’t actually worth the effort (as you point out). You can get on more girls, who are higher quality, while doing a lot less work, by doing other things. If you are a confident guy with value then Entourage game could in fact decrease the number and quality of women you get on as it is a massive time sink.

    So Entourage game is actually of no use to anyone. It is just another piece of ‘game technology’ like routines that do not actually help men at all. But Entourage game boot camps and one-on-ones can be marketed just like any other piece of game technology. You just take a high value guy who would have got laid anyway, get him to do Entourage game, then describe on boards or take pictures and videos of him ‘using’ the technology to get laid.

  11. I remember listening a pick-up artist podcast episode with Adam Lyons years ago where he spoke about entourge gaming.You actually broke it down Kraus.I doubt that it’s a beta form of picking up.

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  13. Krauss looks like you fell for Adam Lyons marketing myths- hook, line and sinker. I am all too aware of Adam Lyons as he scammed me out of £1100 for a 13 hour “Entourage Bootcamp” he could’ve summed up in one hour. If you google “Adam Lyons should I spill the beans” I gave a full breakdown of why Entourage Game is bunk with full references coming from contradictory interviews Adam gave as well as my experiences seeing Adam unable to hook a single set during Daygame- let alone a single successful night-game invite.
    Another clencher is Pete Sheriff (the real founder of Project Entourage Game) who said both he and Adam Lyons PAID full VIP table price £500 like very other club goer and paid for the girls entry. Even Puff Daddy doesn’t get free table or drinks at Paper Nightclub despite the immense, fame, money and female “value” he brings into such a venue.
    As for Paper I hated it- it was the most boring Nightclub experience. I felt like a child “sit still”, “don’t approach other VIP tables that are seated” “stop staring” (Adam didn’t approach a single girl that night). When Adam went home I broke all these rules and ended up having a great time chatting to other tables and getting some honest feedback from club goers.
    Also Adam never “PR closes” no his “Diary of a Pick Up Artist” confirmed all girls he went out with were just female friends he knew from his days as a PR man and NOT strangers from the street (where he said all the numbers were flakes).

  14. Interesting post mate. I stubbled back upon it because I recently saw SocialKenny’s post on Adam and Amanda Lyons.

    It sounds like entourage game would’ve been something I would’ve been interested back in college. And, in a way, my roommates and I tried to do something of the sort…. with minor success (a very small group of girls).

    But, I think you hit the whole nightclub validation scene on the head.

    I’ve noticed something about myself, and that’s that I rarely go out anymore, but when I do I’ve realized when I have fun and when I don’t – when I do, it’s just going out with a group of male friends and having fun – yeah, we’ll flirt with girls and sometimes take one home – but it’s hardly the priority.

    Going out and being a relentless pussy-hound and approach monkey is/was only fun in the beginning stages of game, and going out with guys who are relentless pussy-hound approach monkeys isn’t fun because pussy becomes their sole source for validation for the night. Guys like this become catty and develop female-like behaviors and are generally just not that fun to be around for long periods of time.

    • You’ve essentially described what entourage game was Willy Wonka.

      Towards the end, Adam realised that the best way you can ever really hook up with people is via warm leads through friend introductions. And it is ironically how most people tend to meet each other.

      The problem for guys joining the community is that they don’t have the social networks in place to be able to meet people. So the community initially places a heavy emphasis on a person to go out and practice starting conversations from cold and improving your communication skills. Because it’s this that gives a person the ability to start new relationships and make friends which leaks over to other areas of your life, like building a huge social circle.

      Most guys get stuck on this stage and believe to be the only way to meet people for the sake of getting laid. When really, what’s happening is that you’re disqualifying yourself from building a relationship with that person beyond sex… She may well be someone who could be great friends with you and potentially introduce you to her other friends, or someone that could be the perfect woman for you.

      It’s a natural process that happens with everyone that joins the community. Adam simply labelled it in a way that the community could understand.

      But essentially, you’re whole goal is to go out and do the things you’re passionate about and make friends along the way who are into the same things as you. Over time, you will meet more girls and potentially find someone that you’ll be most happy with.

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